Interview with
- Clive Barker -
Global Land Navigator
Few people have done what Clive Barker has done traveling around the
world in a van.
Clive knows that the Global Positioning System is a powerful resource for land navigation, which can lead you to places you want to go, but it can also get you in a lot of trouble.
AT RIGHT: Photo of Clive's Mercedes van at the Equatorial monument with "all zeros" GPS readout overlaid.
This interview with Clive Barker, world navigator, is an inspiration for would-be global land navigators. Clive was interviewed by email while he was traveling in South America.
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Doug: Clive, thanks for agreeing to be interviewed. I enjoy reading your email "Episodes" where I get to live vicariously through your travels. So far, your pan-american trip has been action packed. Our readers can learn much from your experiences. First let me get your vitals.
Clive: I'm 62 years of age, born in Bournemouth, England.
Doug: Who do you travel with?
Clive: My wife and I are members of The Silk Route Motorcaravan Club (l'Association Camping-Cars sur les Routes de la Soie et du Monde). On our current adventure, we started out in the company of 3 other vehicles.
Doug: Please, describe your vehicle to our readers.
Clive: It is a Mercedes Benz panel van 23.5 feet long with a gross weight of 7.5 tons. It is extremely robust with a heavy duty suspension and dampers. It has a 4litre turbo diesel engine. There are 6 wheels, with the 4 rear ones having chunky mud and snow specified tyres. There are front and rear tow points and shipping tie down points. The rear suspension is raised 2 inches to help with rough roads, getting on ferries etc. The vehicle carries 250 liters of fuel, enough for about 1000 miles with careful driving and no mountains.
It is painted black and has been designed to have a high level of security. Accordingly it has only 3 windows in the habitation area which have removable security bars. The driving cab can be isolated from the habitation area with a steel plated door locked by 2 high security padlocks. There are 2 marine quality roof hatches with ½" Perspex. All doors have high security deadlocks. There is no fixed ladder to the roof. Extra light and air can be introduced by opening a large side opening door.
Inside the décor is beech woodwork with navy blue patterned upholstery. There is a double bed (bed for 2). This is raised up about 3 ½ feet so that the doors to the rear of the van give access to a large storage area. In the kitchen area we have a 4 burner hob, grill and oven with an overhead extractor fan. Cooking is by propane gas or similar and this is stored in a fixed 80 liter tank slung under the chassis. The gas is only used for cooking and is enough to last about a year.
We have a 2 bowl stainless sink with hot and cold running water and a separate faucet for drinking water. There is an electrically powered compressor 90 liter fridge with freezing compartment and a microwave.
There are numerous cupboards and overhead shelves together with storage under the seating. As we travel for many months we take a great range of stores, spare parts, tools, books, games, computer and other equipment and so on.
We have a bathroom with a shower and toilet. The toilet is a cassette type which is easier to empty in out of the way places. Hot water is from a 20 liter hot water tank. This is heated from the engine when we are driving or by an immersion heater. The immersion heater can be powered from an outside supply or by the generator. Alternatively the engine cooling water can be heated by a separate diesel heater. This also passes through a heat exchanger which blows hot air around the vehicle including under the bed and in the wardrobe.
The electrical system is designed to run in several ways. Most equipment runs at 12v or 24v from large auxiliary batteries which are charged from the engine and solar panels or the generator through a computer controlled system. Mains electricity is the European 220 v and this can be provided from a shore line, the generator or a 4kw inverter.
We carry 400 liters of water which is enough for a week or even 10 days if we are careful. All the water is filtered before it goes into the tank. It is filtered again for general distribution and filtered again to the drinking water faucet. With this system we have never in several years living in the vehicle had any illness from the water supply. We have filled our tank from streams and rivers as well as from public supplies.
Other equipment includes a CB radio, 2 MP3/ CD radios, a reversing camera system, and low powered cooling fans. We don't have aircon. This is a conscious decision as we take the view that living in a cool environment would discourage us from going out in the heat to see the things we have traveled so far to see. And repeatedly suffering the thermal shock is most uncomfortable. We find that we acclimatize over a period. We have a good alarm system and immobilizer. And of course we have GPS. We have a Garmin hand held and a computer based system.
In general our philosophy is to have as many redundant systems as possible so that we can keep going whatever happens. For example we have 2 safes for valuables. We treat our vehicle as if we were in a space ship - in many situations we are completely dependent on its reliability.
Lastly we have that essential piece of equipment all sophisticated travelers carry - a corkscrew!
Doug: Wow. You are prepared. I understand that you've been on several trips prior to your current Pan-Am adventure.
Clive: Our first big trip was to drive from England to China and back. The outward route was through Europe, Romania, Bulgaria and Turkey. Then we visited Georgia (not the US state), and Azerbaijan. We crossed the Caspian Sea on a train ferry landing in Turkmenistan. Then Uzbekistan and Kyrgystan and eventually into the Xingjian province in the far west of China. We crossed the Taklamaken desert to Beijing and then went south through Shanghai to Kunming near Hong Kong. From there we drove into the Himalyas to Tibet. After 2000 kms we reached Lhasa and then Nepal. We went though India, Pakistan, Iran and back to Turkey and then back to England.
Our second major trip took us back through Turkey and Iran to Pakistan, then along the Karakorum Highway through the Himalayas direct into China. We then visited Kyrgystan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, and then Russia. Fortunately the border in the far west into Mongolia had just been opened and we were only the second group of foreigners to cross. We drove across Mongolia through the Gobi desert to Ulaan Bataar, the capital. Then we went north into Siberia and west for 1000s of kms into European Russia, the Baltic States, Poland and back to England.
On our present journey we have driven through Mexico and Central America and aim to visit every country in South America.
Doug: How do you decide where and when to travel?
Clive: Where to go is usually somewhere we haven't been before - ideas are discussed until a general target is agreed. When to go depends on the weather and how long we estimate preparations will take.
Doug: How do you plan your route (prior to leaving on your trip)?
Clive: This isn't an easy question. It just sort of happens. One person may have an idea they want to go to a particular place. Others think that sounds interesting. Some say we could go via another place and from several suggestions a general concept emerges. Then the practicalities of timing, weather, places of interest, bottlenecks and so on are pushed around until a more detailed route is agreed.
Doug: Can you share with our readers some on-line resources for planning trips though several countries by land?
World heritage sites (www.worldheritagesites.org) are mostly fabulous places to visit. The most popular guide to world travel is Lonely Planet (www.lonelyplanet.com). Check out the Thorntree link for traveler's questions and answers to any travel problem. For climate information (www.worldclimate.com). For health advice (www.cdc.gov/travel/index.htm)
Doug: What mapping software do you use?
Clive: We use Fugawi.
Doug: Where do you get maps for the Fugawi program?
Clive: These are almost entirely scanned paper maps. Getting large enough scale maps even from Fugawi is a great problem – eg Guyana but we have tracked down maps to cover every country. However maps of these areas are often very inaccurate with roads and even bridges being nonexistent. I think that often planned roads are included even if they haven’t been built yet.
Doug: When you are stopped and searched by foreign government authorities, do they know about GPS hardware, do they try to confiscate it?
Clive: Generally we don't advertise the fact, but we have never had any problems. The only country where there was doubt that we have visited was Russia where it was supposedly illegal but equipment was openly on sale in Moscow. It is also supposedly illegal in China - again we never made it known we had the equipment but they did have a go at confiscating our CB radios. In the end our guide had to carry them in a customs sealed package under dire threats if the seals were not intact when we left the country.
Doug: Tell about a time when GPS has gotten you in trouble (in regard to navigation, leading you in a direction you should not have traveled):
Clive: One of the problems with GPS is that although the location it advises you is extremely accurate, the position needs to be related to what's on the ground and what's on the map. So looking at a track on an inaccurate map can lead you to believe you are somewhere you aren't. For this reason when traveling long distances the GPS must be only one tool amongst several for finding your way. In one incident in China we were directed to a road to the place we were due to visit next. After we had been traveling along for 20 kilometers or so the GPS indicated we were 10 kms off our route. So we turned around and found another road the GPS indicated was correct. We ended up in a restricted area and were held up a for 2 or 3 hours and were only released under threat of deportation if we entered another restricted area. It turned out the original road we took was the correct one - it was the map that was wrong.
Doug: Tell about a time when GPS has saved your life:
I can't really say that the GPS has saved my life but in Mongolia there are no roads - just tracks. And not just one track there are multiple tracks sometimes running parallel over a width of 10 kms or more. When a junction comes there is a criss-cross of tracks leading in every direction. Some might lead around a large hill in the wrong direction to our intended route but swing round later to join up with the other tracks. So it is very easy to go wandering off into the middle of the Gobi desert into nowhere. So the GPS is an essential tool to keep us out of trouble.
Doug: In general, what advice can you give to others planning epic journeys like the one you are on now?
Clive: Planning and preparation are the key. Research everything carefully but don't be deterred by negative responses from friends and family, or negative government advice. Make your own assessment and decide whether the risks are as great as made out and whether the challenge and adventure make it all worthwhile. Also take your time with your preparations.
Doug: How can others follow your progress?
Clive: On the web at www.panam.org.uk
Doug: Thanks Clive this has been very informative. Good luck to your on your travels.
